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Soundtrack Fellowship -nothing new!

fabo
(erft-3e35684e.pool.mediaways.net)


  Responses to this Comment:
Serge Desir
Mark Celoria
Justin
Wolf
kwekiwi
Maximus the Spaniard
Soundtrack Fellowship -nothing new!   Saturday, November 24, 2001 (4:58 a.m.) 

In my oppinon the Soundtrack for Lord of the Rings shows nothing new.
It is all a mix of Braveheart, Titanic and perhaps Gladiator.
Especially the flute theme is very "Horneresque" and reminds me to Titanic.
The voice solo in "Breaking the Fellowship" is written in the same style
als "Now We Are Free"(Gladiator).
But I have also to mention, that it is quite a good work of Shore -but he
only copies the style of other composers here to get into the "major leago" of composers -like Williams, Horner, zimmer etc.

good work, but nothing special, nothing really new!

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Serge Desir
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  In Response to:
fabo

  Responses to this Comment:
donoglen
MCB
Re: Soundtrack Fellowship -nothing new!   Saturday, November 24, 2001 (6:23 a.m.) 

> In my oppinon the Soundtrack for Lord of the Rings shows nothing new.
>
It is all a mix of Braveheart, Titanic and perhaps Gladiator.
>
Especially the flute theme is very "Horneresque" and reminds
> me to Titanic.
The voice solo in "Breaking the Fellowship"
> is written in the same style
als "Now We Are
> Free"(Gladiator).
But I have also to mention, that it is quite a
> good work of Shore -but he
only copies the style of other composers
> here to get into the "major leago" of composers -like Williams,
> Horner, zimmer etc.

> good work, but nothing special, nothing really new!

If one accepts this argument, then one would have to recognize that none of the "big-time" film composers are all that "special" or all that "new."

If one listens to the familiar sounds of Jaws, one hears a very similar sound in the beginning of Dvorak's 4th Movement of the 9th Symphony. The Imperial March, lauded as one of the greatest all time themes by many (myself included) is VERY similar to Holst's Mars from The Planets.

Let's be careful about these kinds of comments. The fact is that most artists are influenced by others and this is not necessarily a bad thing.

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donoglen
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  In Response to:
Serge Desir
Re: Soundtrack Fellowship -nothing new!   Thursday, December 6, 2001 (11:15 p.m.) 

For the "nothing new" crowd--what do you expect, Elven masters to whisper a "new" style of music in mere mortal ears?

Re the choice of Enya, from the first time I heard her voice (1988, the album that later became the Celts), I knew she was perfect for this, and had never considered Elizabeth Fraser but being a fan of the Cocteau Twins, found the counterpoint between Irish and Scottish etherealness to be a remarkably creative way to differentiate the High and Gray Elves of the story.

For the unrepentant purists demanding something new--no doubt, Bach would have bored you to tears what with those constant revisions of earlier works...indeed, the Vienna masters would start sounding old after listening to them week after week. Relish the riches of music you have around you--that you need not sit in a royal court to get it--and cease whining that not all achieve Mozart.



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MCB
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  In Response to:
Serge Desir
Imperial March/Mars   Tuesday, January 22, 2002 (3:26 p.m.) 

>The Imperial March, ... is VERY similar to Holst's Mars from The Planets.

Ummm... no it's not. At all.



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Mark Celoria
(ppp61.tele-base.net)

  In Response to:
fabo

  Responses to this Comment:
fabo
There is NOTHING new under the sun.   Tuesday, November 27, 2001 (9:54 a.m.) 

Sorry to burst your bubble but the scores for Titanic, Braveheart and Gladiator were not new either. The question here is, "Is the score good?" The answer is YES! Shore admits to researching the history of epics and music that is associated with it. LotR is a classic....the father of all fantasies! So why would Shore be avante gaurde (sp?) in any way???


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fabo
(erft-3e356997.pool.mediaways.net)

  In Response to:
Mark Celoria

  Responses to this Comment:
Mark Celoria
Re: There is NOTHING new under the sun.   Tuesday, November 27, 2001 (12:10 p.m.) 

The question here is, "Is the score
> good?" The answer is YES! Shore admits to researching the history of
> epics and music that is associated with it. LotR is a classic....the
> father of all fantasies! So why would Shore be avante gaurde (sp?) in any
> way???

If the question is: "Is the score good?" in what way it is good? In what way Soundtracks are seen as good soundtracks? You cannot say only because LotR is th father of all fantasies so the score must be a classic!


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Mark Celoria
(ppp61.tele-base.net)

  In Response to:
fabo
It is good.   Tuesday, November 27, 2001 (2:09 p.m.) 

I'm not saying it's good because it's the father of fantasy. The score is a serious work that stands alone. I am impressed with the music even apart from the movie. The reference to the book was to illustrate why Shore couldn't do anything "new" here. The books are classics. The music needs to have a familiar feel as well. Make any sense?

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Justin
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  In Response to:
fabo

  Responses to this Comment:
fabo
The funny thing is...   Wednesday, November 28, 2001 (7:17 a.m.) 

> In my oppinon the Soundtrack for Lord of the Rings shows nothing new.
>
It is all a mix of Braveheart, Titanic and perhaps Gladiator.
>
Especially the flute theme is very "Horneresque" and reminds
> me to Titanic.
The voice solo in "Breaking the Fellowship"
> is written in the same style
als "Now We Are
> Free"(Gladiator).
But I have also to mention, that it is quite a
> good work of Shore -but he
only copies the style of other composers
> here to get into the "major leago" of composers -like Williams,
> Horner, zimmer etc.

> good work, but nothing special, nothing really new!

The funny thing is, to be correct in your statement, you could have said the flute theme is very "Horneresque" and reminds me of Willow or an even earlier work. I think he used that same (pan?) flute in Krull. I could be wrong... But still, the fact that you mention Horner makes my skin crawl. That man has sold out in the worst way, recycling his own work at a pace a hundred times faster than John Williams would ever dare. I mean, is Horner going to fit that damned metallic drum into every score he does?!

Anyway, Why the heck does everyone bring up Zimmer's Gladiator when talking about this? Gladiator is a rehash of already made themes, as if Hans just took the temp track and timed it to the movie! If you must compare LotR:FotR to something, go and get the 1978 score to the animated movie...

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fabo
(erft-3e356906.pool.mediaways.net)

  In Response to:
Justin

  Responses to this Comment:
Justin
Re: The funny thing is...   Wednesday, November 28, 2001 (12:19 p.m.) 

> The funny thing is, to be correct in your statement, you could have said
> the flute theme is very "Horneresque" and reminds me of
> Willow or an even earlier work. I think he used that same
> (pan?) flute in Krull. I could be wrong... But still, the fact that you
> mention Horner makes my skin crawl. That man has sold out in the worst
> way, recycling his own work at a pace a hundred times faster than John
> Williams would ever dare. I mean, is Horner going to fit that damned
> metallic drum into every score he does?!

good point. I am happy to see that we do agree with the Horner-Thing!

> Anyway, Why the heck does everyone bring up Zimmer's Gladiator when
> talking about this? Gladiator is a rehash of already made themes, as if
> Hans just took the temp track and timed it to the movie! If you must
> compare LotR:FotR to something, go and get the 1978 score to the animated
> movie...

The only way to review a soundtrack is to compare. Compare it with others.
If we do not mention other composer styles we compare either -with the help of our knowlege about filmmusic. So I think it is not a false to compare!

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Justin
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rd1.Level3.net)

  In Response to:
fabo

  Responses to this Comment:
fabo
Re: The funny thing is...   Wednesday, November 28, 2001 (9:15 p.m.) 

> good point. I am happy to see that we do agree with the Horner-Thing!

How could we not? It's only the truth!

> The only way to review a soundtrack is to compare. Compare it with others.
>
If we do not mention other composer styles we compare either -with the
> help of our knowlege about filmmusic. So I think it is not a false to
> compare!

I was a little vauge in what I meant to say. I was trying to state, why would you compare LotR:FotR to Gladiator when there are scores that sound so much closer to FotR?

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fabo
(erft-3e356842.pool.mediaways.net)

  In Response to:
Justin
Re: The funny thing is...   Thursday, November 29, 2001 (1:23 p.m.) 

> I was a little vauge in what I meant to say. I was trying to state, why
> would you compare LotR:FotR to Gladiator when there are scores that sound
> so much closer to FotR?

OK. The comparison with gladiator is perhaps because gladiator is still
one of the scores which are in discussion now -and so it's simple to compare it
beacause everybody knows whatI am talking about...
But you're right there are Scores that are better to compare with LotR.


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Wolf
(proxy3.avamex.krakow.pl)

  In Response to:
fabo
That's what I thought, too...   Sunday, December 2, 2001 (10:38 a.m.) 

> good work, but nothing special, nothing really new!

That was more or less my opinion, too. It's really good *FOR SHORE*, whom I never liked. But overall, it's nothing to match even the bottoms of the top of the genre, IYKWIM . I still say Kilar should have accepted Peter Jackson's offer to score the movie, and when he turned it down, PJ should have considered Jerry Goldsmith or Basil Poledouris (they seem to be a little "sleepy" lately, and this offer would certainly allow them to unleash their full potential again)...

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kwekiwi
(open191.mscd.edu)

  In Response to:
fabo
What?? get OFF me!!   Wednesday, December 5, 2001 (2:28 p.m.) 

> In my oppinon the Soundtrack for Lord of the Rings shows nothing new.
>
It is all a mix of Braveheart, Titanic and perhaps Gladiator.
>
Especially the flute theme is very "Horneresque" and reminds
> me to Titanic.
The voice solo in "Breaking the Fellowship"
> is written in the same style
als "Now We Are
> Free"(Gladiator).
But I have also to mention, that it is quite a
> good work of Shore -but he
only copies the style of other composers
> here to get into the "major leago" of composers -like Williams,
> Horner, zimmer etc.

> good work, but nothing special, nothing really new!

WHAT?!?! I own and adore all four of these scores, and you are a CRACKER. The only thing that seems similar to me between the voice solos is that they are both distinctly imaginative. You can only compose so much music without having SOME of it sound the same as other people's, but that doesn't make it unoriginal by any means. Shore has always had a distinct style, and he sounds like the same composer as he did in his other scores. This is just his first opportunity to compose a fantasy film and use his imagination for the first time in his career. I've found this entire score to be very different from anything i've heard from beginning to end, and it doesn't serve the creativity of the score to compare it to composers with completely different styles. major league my left butt cheek.

p.s. learn how to spell "league".

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Maximus the Spaniard
(213-99-130-34.uc.nombres.ttd.es)

  In Response to:
fabo

  Responses to this Comment:
roybatty
Gladiator??! Titanic??!   Friday, February 15, 2002 (11:58 p.m.) 

> In my oppinon the Soundtrack for Lord of the Rings shows nothing new. > It is all a mix of Braveheart, Titanic and perhaps Gladiator. I guess those are the only scores you have ever hear, arenīt they?


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roybatty
(bb-87-82-13-56.ukonline.co.uk)

  In Response to:
Maximus the Spaniard
Re: Gladiator??! Titanic??!   Tuesday, June 5, 2007 (6:12 p.m.) 

> It is all a mix of Braveheart, Titanic and perhaps Gladiator.

> I guess those are the only scores you have ever hear, arenīt they?

Maybe it's pointless to post this 5 years down the line but I just feel compelled to say that, while I hear no resemblence to GLADIATOR anywhere in the score, the hobbit/shire theme IS actually VERY VERY similar to "Hymn to the Sea" from TITANIC - it's obviously just a reworking of that melody by Horner. You can compare the notes and it is clear to see.


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