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Comments about the soundtrack for The New World (James Horner)
One Word: REHASH

shaantvis
(tmcb-u110-3n10e-ce1.byu.edu)


  Responses to this Comment:
Raijin
Richie Brown
One Word: REHASH   Friday, February 10, 2006 (10:46 a.m.) 

James Horner hasn't done anything original since Braveheart!

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Raijin
(ast-lambert-153-1-36-129.w81-249.
abo.wanadoo.fr)

  In Response to:
shaantvis

  Responses to this Comment:
shaantvis
Re: One Word: REHASH   Saturday, February 11, 2006 (1:45 a.m.) 

> James Horner hasn't done anything original since Braveheart!

Nice lie but try again...

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shaantvis
(tmcb-u110-3n10e-ce1.byu.edu)

  In Response to:
Raijin

  Responses to this Comment:
Stefan Vlahov
Nick
oneofthethree
Re: One Word: REHASH   Saturday, February 11, 2006 (9:33 a.m.) 

> Nice lie but try again...

Thats wonderful of you to come in defense of one the the most overrated film score composers. Go ahead, name a of his scores that does not have those droning, dramatic strings, that awful background choral arrangement, the overblown fanfare, the quiet chime, an awful song based on the main theme (i know not every score has a song but many do: Titanic [Mr. Horner should be shot twice for just this one!], How the Grinch stole Christmas, Beautiful Mind, Troy, and now The New World).
In the end I dont blame Terrence Mallick for replacing James Horner's music with Mozarts and Wagners. Why would any director want his movie to sound like any other movie? James Horner has been doing same score year after year.

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Stefan Vlahov
(adsl-67-37-225-199.dsl.chcgil.ame
ritech.net)

  In Response to:
shaantvis

  Responses to this Comment:
Amuro
Re: One Word: REHASH   Saturday, February 11, 2006 (1:49 p.m.) 

> Thats wonderful of you to come in defense of one the the most overrated
> film score composers. Go ahead, name a of his scores that does not have
> those droning, dramatic strings, that awful background choral arrangement,
> the overblown fanfare, the quiet chime, an awful song based on the main
> theme (i know not every score has a song but many do

Here is a list from most recent to oldest:
Legend of Zorro
Chumscrubber
Flightplan
House of Sand and Fog
Beyond Borders
Iris
Bicentenial Man
Mighty Joe YOung
Mask of Zorro
Balto
Jumanji
Apollo 13

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Amuro
(12-222-116-128.client.insightbb.c
om)
Profile Picture
  In Response to:
Stefan Vlahov

  Responses to this Comment:
Michael Pipolo
CheAnnDav
Re: yes... rehash... but enjoyable rehash?!   Saturday, February 11, 2006 (7:13 p.m.) 

> Here is a list from most recent to oldest:
Legend of Zorro
>
Chumscrubber
Flightplan
House of Sand and Fog
Beyond
> Borders
Iris
Bicentenial Man
Mighty Joe YOung
Mask of
> Zorro
Balto
Jumanji
Apollo 13

Congratulations! You've let this escalade to a fight between two first graders! This is just great, every review I go to, its the same fighting just like when I was 12 and my friends used to argue that Hans Zimmer wrote original stuff... I won that argument (against him) every time.

Horner has his moments, he does. "A Beautiful Mind" is a great score, I love it to no end. However, would I claim its incredibly original? Dear lord no I wouldn't. Its rehashed music, one must learn to look at it not as rehash but as music. Of course it gets frustrating, turning on "The Mask of Zorro" (yes the very score you mention 4th to last on this list!) and hearing a blaring rendition of the "danger theme." Where else have I heard this? Oh yeah!, "Star Trek II," "Troy," and countless other places. I don't really want to take a side here, because I can see both of your poorly explained arguments so I'll just continue with my train of thought... sound good? I honestly don't care if it does or not.

I think its funny how the same argument is always brought against Horner... however I also think its funny that he claims he "doesn't remember his older scores, he just writes what comes to him." thats a lie. "The New World" sounds like rehash... it sounds like the typical Hornerisms we've all come to love/hate. Yet, I just might buy it, and I just might listen to it over and over again. Because as much as I dislike the rehash, I kinda like it too. Admittedly, it should be more original for the film (or rather, for a good film... this one looks like pure crap), but on a simple listening level, it'll sound good right? One thing I've learned from listening over and over again is this... Horner steals from himself in EVERYTHING... no matter what you might claim, he borrows. At some point you have to stop judging it as film music and start judging it as music. Now I'm not saying that film music isn't music... I love film music, I'm saying that with Horner you have to seperate the music from the film to enjoy it. This is hard, but it can be done. I don't listen to "Braveheart" and think of Williams Wallace screaming "FREEEDDDOOOM!" I think of sitting outside a hotel room in Tenessee where I was listening to it while reading the book "Animal Farm." I in no way think that "Braveheart" is original, in fact I think its a rehahs of "Legends of the Fall" in many ways. "Apollo 13" isn't original either... you can hear plenty of his earlier scores poking around, they're just more subdued.

For the longest time (I was young) "Willow" was my favorite film score of all time... but the opening of "Willow the Sorcerer" is Mozart's requiem! Its possible to enjoy the rehash as long as its still good as music... no, as a film score, it doesn't work, but as a CD it does.

Now of course you're all going to say "The point isn't to be a CD, its to fit the film!" and you're absolutely right, so in this respect, Horner fails almost everytime right? Again, I disagree... write a better film score to represent the schizophrenia of "A Beautiful Mind." You bring out the thematic mastery and comic book charm of "The Rocketeer." Its rehash, oh yes it is, but occasionally Rehash can fit a film.

The problem with all of you is that you're too simple minded, incapable of taking in views which might cancel each other out. Honestly, I've contradicted myself at least 4 or 5 times in this little message alone. You know why? Because its music, and you can't simply judge music... its a category all its own. Music isn't something you can just nail with a simple phrase of "rehash" its something you have to think about for a long time, and then realize... will bring out so many emotions and opinions that you can't not contradict yourself with your opinions of it.

The minute you start treating music so simply is the minute you forget what it is and start treating it like some common logical entity, such as mathematics. Let music do what it must, let it be emotional...

So in this case, its not Mr. Horner who fails... its the people who argue for or against him, and are blinded by such ignorance. And when you realize that both views are right, you'll realize how astounding, and dirivitive music can be.

First day of composition lessons, my teacher told me this: "You're going to steal something... be it from yourself of someone famous... you'll do it, everyone does."

Hoping that this knocks some sense into people, and also hoping that people don't take too much offense,

Amuro

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Michael Pipolo
(livmainborder.wispwest.net)

  In Response to:
Amuro

  Responses to this Comment:
Amuro
Re: yes... rehash... but enjoyable rehash?!   Sunday, February 12, 2006 (9:18 p.m.) 

Well, Amuro. That was an excellent read. Kudos to Amuro for taking the time to write to so many people who don't care to listen.

Right you are... and so eloquent as well. I couldn't have stated it better myself. Good job!

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Amuro
(12-222-116-128.client.insightbb.c
om)
Profile Picture
  In Response to:
Michael Pipolo
Re: Thanks! *NM*   Monday, February 13, 2006 (7:25 p.m.) 



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CheAnnDav
(tmcb-u110-3n10e-ce1.byu.edu)

  In Response to:
Amuro

  Responses to this Comment:
Amuro
Re: yes... rehash... but enjoyable rehash?!   Monday, February 13, 2006 (3:01 a.m.) 

I'm not convinced.

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Amuro
(12-222-116-128.client.insightbb.c
om)
Profile Picture
  In Response to:
CheAnnDav
Re: I don't care if you're convinced...   Monday, February 13, 2006 (7:21 p.m.) 

Do you think I took the time out of my schedule to convince you of my opinion? Notice, I used the word opinion, thus making it not fact. However, I have politely offered mine here, and if you'd like to offer your reasoning as to "not being convinced" thats great... if you don't... thats great too.

My point wasn't to "convince" anybody... it was to do what this forum is meant for... offer my opinion. I merely hoped that someone might read it and say "hey... thats a valid point." But what exactly doesn't convince you? I'm curious... I'm always looking for ways to spruce up my argument so that I can have the best argument possible when the time comes to defend it.

Hoping for some feedback,

Amuro

P.S. Did anyone else notice that the last track of PotC sounds curiously like the 6th movement of Percy Grainger's "Lincolnshire Posy" the movement is entitled "The Lost Lady Found." The rhythmic and harmonic similarities are a little too close for comfort at times... just curious...

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Nick
<Send E-Mail>
(cpe001111e92573-cm0010954a0ee8.cp
e.net.cable.rogers.com)

  In Response to:
shaantvis

  Responses to this Comment:
shaantvis
Two words: PISS OFF!   Saturday, February 11, 2006 (11:57 p.m.) 

> Thats wonderful of you to come in defense of one the the most overrated
> film score composers

> i know not every score has a song but many do: Titanic [Mr. Horner
> should be shot twice for just this one!], How the Grinch stole Christmas,
> Beautiful Mind, Troy, and now The New World).

Shot twice?

What kind of a disgusting fool are you to say a composer should be shot for anything?

>James Horner has been doing same score year after year.

If that's what you think, DON"T BUY THE DAMN SCORE ALBUMS!



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shaantvis
(tmcb-u110-3n10e-ce1.byu.edu)

  In Response to:
Nick

  Responses to this Comment:
Amuro
Re: Two words: PISS OFF!   Sunday, February 12, 2006 (9:28 a.m.) 

> Shot twice?

> What kind of a disgusting fool are you to say a composer should be shot
> for anything?

> If that's what you think, DON"T BUY THE DAMN SCORE ALBUMS!

Disgusting fool? Hahahaha Thank you for noticing! Yes i think James Horner should be shot and you should too for being so passionate about him! and no i will not be one who feels the need to drop down 10-15 dollars on a cd that i bought 5 years ago!

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Amuro
(12-222-116-128.client.insightbb.c
om)
Profile Picture
  In Response to:
shaantvis
Re: Thats exactly what I'm talking about... *NM*   Sunday, February 12, 2006 (9:56 a.m.) 



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oneofthethree
(dsl54025bea.pool.t-online.hu)

  In Response to:
shaantvis
Re: One Word: REHASH   Monday, November 27, 2006 (12:38 p.m.) 

> Mr. Horner
> should be shot twice for just this one!

Everyday nightmare, you idiot, because of such idiots who will never understand a word.



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Richie Brown
<Send E-Mail>
(ip68-111-120-66.pn.at.cox.net)

  In Response to:
shaantvis
Re: One Word: REHASH   Monday, December 18, 2006 (5:33 p.m.) 
• Now Playing: Regina Spektor - Summer in the City  

> James Horner hasn't done anything original since Braveheart!

GO screw yourself.



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