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Comments about the soundtrack for War of the Worlds (John Williams)
Yeah but...

Corey Caudill
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  Responses to this Comment:
Nick
alfredo
Yeah but...   Saturday, July 2, 2005 (9:17 p.m.) 

Ok, so this isn't a pretty John Williams score but have you heard it with the movie! Dear god its perfect! I thought the movie was VERY well done and the score was top notch. I mean, he referenced Stravinsky for Christs sake... in a summer sci-fi blockbuster!!! Anyone who though John Williams was breaking the mold by using the Wagner like motifs in Star Wars should recognize the love behind the score to War of the World. Five stars, Mr. Willams!

Corey

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Nick
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  In Response to:
Corey Caudill

  Responses to this Comment:
Fraley
Re: Yeah but...   Saturday, July 2, 2005 (11:05 p.m.) 

> Ok, so this isn't a pretty John Williams score but have you heard it with
> the movie! Dear god its perfect! I thought the movie was VERY well done
> and the score was top notch. I mean, he referenced Stravinsky for Christs
> sake... in a summer sci-fi blockbuster!!! Anyone who though John Williams
> was breaking the mold by using the Wagner like motifs in Star Wars should
> recognize the love behind the score to War of the World. Five stars, Mr.
> Willams!

> Corey

So Williams referenced some classical works and gets praise, while James Horner references classical works and gets bashed...Nothing against Williams or anything, but that double-standard sickens me.


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Fraley
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  In Response to:
Nick

  Responses to this Comment:
Corey Caudill
Re: Yeah but...   Sunday, July 3, 2005 (12:40 a.m.) 

> So Williams referenced some classical works and gets praise, while James
> Horner references classical works and gets bashed...Nothing against
> Williams or anything, but that double-standard sickens me.

The difference being Williams references a classical work within the context of his original score, versus Horner who has on occasion structured his entire score around a "borrowed" theme or piece, as well as the fact that Williams doesn't make a habbit of it, and Horner does. Its tougher to be forgiving on Horner for it since he "borrows" ideas so frequently.

That said, I do enjoy listening to most of Horner's scores. They tend to flow well, and are very pleasing to the ear even if they aren't very original.

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Corey Caudill
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  In Response to:
Fraley

  Responses to this Comment:
Nick
Re: Yeah but...   Sunday, July 3, 2005 (12:03 p.m.) 

Look, I am a huge Horner fan, but I'm simply commenting on the ongoing strife with film score fans concerning the fact that the music from a movie is suppose to complement the movie, not the soundtrack album. I am proud to say that I have never once bashed Horner and I will be one of those people who buy ever album of his music that comes out.

Corey

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Nick
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Corey Caudill

  Responses to this Comment:
Robin
Re: Yeah but...   Sunday, July 3, 2005 (6:44 p.m.) 

> Look, I am a huge Horner fan, but I'm simply commenting on the ongoing
> strife with film score fans concerning the fact that the music from a
> movie is suppose to complement the movie, not the soundtrack album. I am
> proud to say that I have never once bashed Horner and I will be one of
> those people who buy ever album of his music that comes out.

> Corey

I never assumed you were bashing Horner...I was just stating something that is basically common knowledge among film music fans.

On a side note, I am on the side of 'fits the film', because if the films weren't made, the music wouldn't exist.;)


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Robin
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  In Response to:
Nick

  Responses to this Comment:
Nick
Re: Yeah but...   Sunday, July 3, 2005 (7:04 p.m.) 

> I never assumed you were bashing Horner...I was just stating something
> that is basically common knowledge among film music fans.

> On a side note, I am on the side of 'fits the film', because if the films
> weren't made, the music wouldn't exist.;)

Bah.. he's hardly referencing stravinsky. He's got a cluster of staccato strings playing a rhythmical pattern. Is that really a stravinsky copyright? It's far from the same orchestration or voicing, does that make it a stravinsky homage? You guys are always analyzing, aren't you? Don't you think it's possible to come up with these things without necesarily knowing a similar piece? Why do you think it's even necessary for Williams to draw inspiration from other classical composers when he clearly possesses the creativity and intellect to come up with these ideas himself?

I'm so tired of people always trying to point out what "old classical pieces" composers are quoting. It obviously never occur to you that some of these composers are more than able to come up with these things themselves.

Robin

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Nick
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  In Response to:
Robin

  Responses to this Comment:
Amuro
Re: Yeah but...   Sunday, July 3, 2005 (8:15 p.m.) 

> Bah.. he's hardly referencing stravinsky. He's got a cluster of staccato
> strings playing a rhythmical pattern. Is that really a stravinsky
> copyright? It's far from the same orchestration or voicing, does that make
> it a stravinsky homage? You guys are always analyzing, aren't you? Don't
> you think it's possible to come up with these things without necesarily
> knowing a similar piece? Why do you think it's even necessary for Williams
> to draw inspiration from other classical composers when he clearly
> possesses the creativity and intellect to come up with these ideas
> himself?

> I'm so tired of people always trying to point out what "old classical
> pieces" composers are quoting. It obviously never occur to you that
> some of these composers are more than able to come up with these things
> themselves.

> Robin

If you were responding to me, I'll let you know something: I don't even listen to classical music. When people point out quotes, references, etc, they are lost on me, because I haven't heard the classical piece they are talking about. My response was made to address the fact that I read how James Horner used 4 or 5 notes that sound similar to some classical piece, and gets dumped on for it, while Williams does the same thing and gets praised. Regardless of how often the quoting happens, I just hate the 'double-standard' of sorts.

A recent example of this is how people thought "Troy" quoted "Stargate", while the melody was actually from scores like "Glory", written before both scores mentioned (and apparently was also similar to a classical piece, but I don't recall its name...fantasia or something like that)

"Stargate" is more recognizable, as it was the main theme. People also ripped into Horner for using a similar melody (itself a classical melody) that Williams used ("Enemy At The Gates" and "Schindler's List")

David Arnold, it could be argued, quoted Horner's "Legends Of The Fall" for his main theme for "ID4" (p.s. Happy 4th of July, America ) as well as Horner's infamous 'four notes' in Arnold's "*-3 Send", a track from "Tomorrow Never Dies" which is made up almost entirely of those notes, played on a flute in the same rhythm that Horner uses it for.

Do I care about quoting, whether it be film score or classical piece?

Not at all, but I do care about singling out composers who do it. and praising some while coming down on others.

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Amuro
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  In Response to:
Nick
Re: Yeah but...   Sunday, July 3, 2005 (10:01 p.m.) 

It doesn't matter whether you mean to or not, as a composer you are always influenced by what you hear. Williams may not have been thinking about Stravinksy when he wrote it, but chances are, it was Stravinsky that placed the motif in his head. As a composer, one will always listen to their own work, and realize that parts of it come from something else.

My composition teacher sat me down on my first lesson and said this...

"You are going to plagerize, whether you mean to or not, it will happen, don't fight it, let it happen."

Amuro

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alfredo
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  In Response to:
Corey Caudill
Tell me if anyone agrees with this   Monday, July 25, 2005 (6:21 p.m.) 

> Ok, so this isn't a pretty John Williams score but have you heard it with
> the movie! Dear god its perfect! I thought the movie was VERY well done
> and the score was top notch. I mean, he referenced Stravinsky for Christs
> sake... in a summer sci-fi blockbuster!!! Anyone who though John Williams
> was breaking the mold by using the Wagner like motifs in Star Wars should
> recognize the love behind the score to War of the World. Five stars, Mr.
> Willams!

> Corey

I'm not sure if this is something I share with all you other film score listeners, but I personally feel that having a interest in this music can sometimes be a bit of a plague. It seems that whenever I see a movie my mind often separates the score from the film so it takes out the whole purpose of the score supporting the film. Now don't get me wrong I am still very capable of enjoying a film, but when it come to a score like WotW that is designed to be subtle it is the raw music that I hear rather than the music as support to the the emotional context of the film and I can be a bit disapointed by what I hear. And I'm sure with a genius like John Williams writing it, it has to be a beautiful expiriance for the average film goer.
Write back your thoughts.
Either way,fantastic movie!

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