I saw Dune last night. Before that, Robert predicted my opinion on the score would fall somewhere between his take ( https://www.filmtracks.com/scoreboard/forum.cgi?read=100293 ) and Erik's ( https://www.filmtracks.com/scoreboard/forum.cgi?read=100326 ). While that's true, that's like saying my opinion of Dune lies somewhere between my feelings for Blade Runner 2049 ( https://www.filmtracks.com/scoreboard/forum.cgi?read=52639 ) and Arrival ( https://www.filmtracks.com/scoreboard/forum.cgi?read=81580 ).

So let's start with the film. Without getting too into the weeds for those that haven't seen it, I really enjoyed it. I'm impressed they managed to adapt (half of) Dune into a good movie, but as far as I can remember it's a pretty faithful adaptation of the film too. It's got its issues, and there was a scene or two I wish had been better fleshed out, but it was a good time overall, didn't feel its length, and stopped at a pretty good point in the story. Really hope we get part 2. Also, there are 4 worm appearances, so I'm tempted to give it 4/4.

I listened to the album (just the one score album, none of the others) twice when it came out, and thought it was dreadfully boring both times, so much so I really had nothing to contribute to the discourse and wasn't sure how it was prompting such impassioned opinions in either direction lol. Someone (who in retrospect I'm pretty sure had not actually seen the film at that point and was just hyping up Hans) insisted a lot of music was left off the album and that it's completely different in context. Well, that's already a knock on the album. Regardless, they were correct in that the music is still in my head this morning after watching the film last night, which is more than I can say about my previous listens.

So, what did I like about the score?
- The main theme. Unsure whether it's meant for Paul or more the planet/film as a whole, but the one with the desert-sounding rising arpeggio on the duduk. Good stuff, has some of the best variation and development, and it's very Zimmer-y. That last part is neither a good nor a bad thing, but it's always nice to hear those little composer signatures.
- The percussion used to represent the Fremen. Unsure what kind of drum that is, but it sounds great. So crisp!
- 'Armada' is a pretty solid cue.
- The wailing woman vocals were not used for the Fremen, which is what I was worried about. Given Dune's use of Arabic/Muslim phrases and imagery, I was worried about bringing back that trope that's been used as a lazy shorthand for anything vaguely 'exotic' sounding. But in context it's actually representative of the Bene Gesserit, more specifically the powers they have, and it emerges whenever Paul taps into that power. Since the Bene Gesserit are all women, in a way the motif appears whenever Paul accesses his feminine side. Conceptually it's pretty good. Emphasis on 'conceptually.'

Okay, on to the things I was less enthusiastic about.
- So the score is either dialed to 11 in the film or mumbling along in the background. If it's not exploding with sound then I'm not really sure what it's doing otherwise.
- Outside of the main theme, none of the other motifs really get much development. Maybe it's because a lot of the story is table setting for Part 2, but there's still lots of movie things to score and address and it doesn't really feel like Zimmer does much with it.
- Bagpipes for House Atreides. Something else I like conceptually, but they only appear twice, and the second time is very sudden. My roommate burst out laughing when they showed up during the battle. I'd even played 'Armada' for him a few weeks ago so he subconsciously knew it was coming. Basically, it feels like a tacked on thing, not really integrated into the score as a whole. (There's an argument to be made this is by design, since the Atreides are sent to rule a planet they know nothing of and cannot adapt to. But then again, whatever other music there is for the Imperium and Harkonnen don't clash as sharply with the Fremen music, and in fact the bagpipes come in the midst of a battle with the former, so I don't think it should stick out as sharply.)
- Then there's the wailing woman. I said I liked it conceptually, but it's one of those things that's always dialed to 11 when its used. Its first appearance, when Paul faces the Gom Jabbar test, it's explodes out of the speakers, and I couldn't figure out whether to react with excitement or laughter. I think if I hadn't heard that motif in the trailer and on the album, I'd have laughed.
- And that brings me to something Ethan said when I was discussing it with him: 'It's not a bad score if I take it seriously. But can I take it seriously?' I think generally I like the ideas Zimmer introduces moreso than his execution of them.

Other:
- Some of Robert's comments in his original post are pretty strange to me, the album doesn't 'end with a whimper, barely summarizing his ideas at the finale.' Like, it's a pretty drawn out merging of the main theme with the wailing motif. Also, wailing motif is pretty clearly about Paul's power.
- I wasn't really feeling the synergy of visuals and music Erik described.
- If anyone takes my comment about the music mostly drifting along in the background and says something like 'This is how I felt about Arrival,' I will block you. Okay, I won't, since there's no blocking on here, but I'll figure out how to. Or just ignore your response. I'm here to talk about Dune, not the other Villeneuve scores
- Goddamn, after all these years I still have to look up how to spell Villeneuve. No wonder we just call him Denis.
- I miss Johann Johannsson.
- I still think A.R. Rahman would've been the perfect composer for this film.
- I wonder how Enya would have scored this. Don't know why, just wondering.
- Should I listen to Toto's Dune score? Also should I listen to the other Zimmer albums? (Unless there's an overwhelming response of yes, I won't.)
- Dave Bautista doesn't have a big role in this film, but also for my money he's the best actor to come out of pro wrestling.
- I love Oscar Isaac's beard. Also he has two heartbreaking lines that I loved.
- The wailing motif has most of the same notes as Harmonica's theme from Morricone's OUATITW and it cracks me up.

Anyway, Dune the film is great, Dune the score is fine. Whatever, I still can't work up that much of a passion about it in either direction haha. 2/5.

Rad-swaggity.

(Message edited on Tuesday, October 26, 2021, at 9:18 a.m.)

Just chipping in to say that Toto’s Dune is great! Cheesy and dated, but so much fun.

> I saw Dune last night. Before that, Robert predicted my opinion on the
> score would fall somewhere between his take (
> https://www.filmtracks.com/scoreboard/forum.cgi?read=100293 ) and Erik's
> ( https://www.filmtracks.com/scoreboard/forum.cgi?read=100326 ). While
> that's true, that's like saying my opinion of Dune lies somewhere between
> my feelings for Blade Runner 2049 (
> https://www.filmtracks.com/scoreboard/forum.cgi?read=52639 ) and Arrival
> ( https://www.filmtracks.com/scoreboard/forum.cgi?read=81580 ).

> So let's start with the film. Without getting too into the weeds for those
> that haven't seen it, I really enjoyed it. I'm impressed they managed to
> adapt (half of) Dune into a good movie, but as far as I can remember it's
> a pretty faithful adaptation of the film too. It's got its issues, and
> there was a scene or two I wish had been better fleshed out, but it was a
> good time overall, didn't feel its length, and stopped at a pretty good
> point in the story. Really hope we get part 2. Also, there are 4 worm
> appearances, so I'm tempted to give it 4/4.

I have a feeling I need to watch it again (the rare time no longer being a movie reviewer might be beneficial -- would've felt bad if I had written the 2.5/5 or 3/5 review I feel after one viewing, then watch it again and go "ohhhh THAT'S what everyone else saw").

I just felt so much apathy to the film apart from the nifty visuals (which I must also say -- I think I'm getting a bit bored with the "Villenvenue Style". Yes, every shot is very mannered and precise and epic-looking, but there's also very little passion or energy to them, and does EVERY shot have to be dark and backlit?). But the story stops right when it's about to get interesting, and the main characters are all so route and sterile I couldn't give less of a fuck about anyone.

Plus, I couldn't stop seeing Edward Scissorhands with Paul.

So I dunno...considering this was my most-looking-forward-to movie of the last couple years, I was very disappointed. Solid flick with a ton of artistry behind it but shit, does it reeeeeally need the other half of it.

> I listened to the album (just the one score album, none of the others)
> twice when it came out, and thought it was dreadfully boring both times,
> so much so I really had nothing to contribute to the discourse and wasn't
> sure how it was prompting such impassioned opinions in either direction
> lol. Someone (who in retrospect I'm pretty sure had not actually seen the
> film at that point and was just hyping up Hans) insisted a lot of music
> was left off the album and that it's completely different in context.
> Well, that's already a knock on the album. Regardless, they were correct
> in that the music is still in my head this morning after watching the film
> last night, which is more than I can say about my previous listens.

I ranked the score album my second least favourite of the year after finally finishing it, which took about a week. I did find that I kinda liked a bunch of the music in context, though, so I dunno...I bet if I took my two or three fave cues from the sketchbook and mixed them with about half of the actual score album, I'd have a 3.5/5 or even higher listening experience.

> So, what did I like about the score?
> - The main theme. Unsure whether it's meant for Paul or more the
> planet/film as a whole, but the one with the desert-sounding rising
> arpeggio on the duduk. Good stuff, has some of the best variation and
> development, and it's very Zimmer-y. That last part is neither a good nor
> a bad thing, but it's always nice to hear those little composer
> signatures.
> - The percussion used to represent the Fremen. Unsure what kind of drum
> that is, but it sounds great. So crisp!
> - 'Armada' is a pretty solid cue.
> - The wailing woman vocals were not used for the Fremen, which is what I
> was worried about. Given Dune's use of Arabic/Muslim phrases and imagery,
> I was worried about bringing back that trope that's been used as a lazy
> shorthand for anything vaguely 'exotic' sounding. But in context it's
> actually representative of the Bene Gesserit, more specifically the powers
> they have, and it emerges whenever Paul taps into that power. Since the
> Bene Gesserit are all women, in a way the motif appears whenever Paul
> accesses his feminine side. Conceptually it's pretty good. Emphasis on
> 'conceptually.'

> Okay, on to the things I was less enthusiastic about.
> - So the score is either dialed to 11 in the film or mumbling along in the
> background. If it's not exploding with sound then I'm not really sure what
> it's doing otherwise.
> - Outside of the main theme, none of the other motifs really get much
> development. Maybe it's because a lot of the story is table setting for
> Part 2, but there's still lots of movie things to score and address and it
> doesn't really feel like Zimmer does much with it.
> - Bagpipes for House Atreides. Something else I like conceptually, but
> they only appear twice, and the second time is very sudden. My roommate
> burst out laughing when they showed up during the battle. I'd even played
> 'Armada' for him a few weeks ago so he subconsciously knew it was coming.
> Basically, it feels like a tacked on thing, not really integrated into the
> score as a whole. (There's an argument to be made this is by design, since
> the Atreides are sent to rule a planet they know nothing of and cannot
> adapt to. But then again, whatever other music there is for the Imperium
> and Harkonnen don't clash as sharply with the Fremen music, and in fact
> the bagpipes come in the midst of a battle with the former, so I don't
> think it should stick out as sharply.)
> - Then there's the wailing woman. I said I liked it conceptually, but it's
> one of those things that's always dialed to 11 when its used. Its first
> appearance, when Paul faces the Gom Jabbar test, it's explodes out
> of the speakers, and I couldn't figure out whether to react with
> excitement or laughter. I think if I hadn't heard that motif in the
> trailer and on the album, I'd have laughed.
> - And that brings me to something Ethan said when I was discussing it with
> him: 'It's not a bad score if I take it seriously. But can I take it
> seriously?' I think generally I like the ideas Zimmer introduces moreso
> than his execution of them.

> Other:
> - Some of Robert's comments in his original post are pretty strange to me,
> the album doesn't 'end with a whimper, barely summarizing his ideas at the
> finale.' Like, it's a pretty drawn out merging of the main theme with the
> wailing motif. Also, wailing motif is pretty clearly about Paul's power.
> - I wasn't really feeling the synergy of visuals and music Erik described.
> - If anyone takes my comment about the music mostly drifting along in the
> background and says something like 'This is how I felt about Arrival,' I
> will block you. Okay, I won't, since there's no blocking on here, but I'll
> figure out how to. Or just ignore your response. I'm here to talk about
> Dune, not the other Villeneuve scores
> - Goddamn, after all these years I still have to look up how to spell
> Villeneuve. No wonder we just call him Denis.
> - I miss Johann Johannsson.
> - I still think A.R. Rahman would've been the perfect composer for this
> film.
> - I wonder how Enya would have scored this. Don't know why, just
> wondering.
> - Should I listen to Toto's Dune score? Also should I listen to the other
> Zimmer albums? (Unless there's an overwhelming response of yes, I won't.)
> - Dave Bautista doesn't have a big role in this film, but also for my
> money he's the best actor to come out of pro wrestling.
> - I love Oscar Isaac's beard. Also he has two heartbreaking lines that I
> loved.
> - The wailing motif has most of the same notes as Harmonica's theme from
> Morricone's OUATITW and it cracks me up.

> Anyway, Dune the film is great, Dune the score is fine. Whatever, I still
> can't work up that much of a passion about it in either direction haha.
> 2/5.

> Rad-swaggity.

Lots of good points there. I would recommend Toto's original score, though, as well as the flick itself -- it's a mess, but a gloriously interesting mess, and frankly I find it more entertaining (and bizarre, and engaging) than the 2021 version. Worse movie, for sure, but somehow that's part of why it's more fun to watch.

Plus, oh yeah, that's the other thing -- the Baron SUCKED in this version!!! In the original I was flat-out scared as a kid watching him float around a fat disgusting vampire sucking blood and laughing maniacally and being super rape-y. So freaky and icky. Skarsgaard here basically just growls in the darkness and occasionally floats in the background for a couple scenes, and that's it. Fuck, this movie pissed me off.

..............but I'm trying to be more positive with stuff cause I'm starting to think I'm actually irritating folks around here, some of whom I'd consider friends, so I best shut up now. Everything's fine. Dune's fine. Movie's are great, music is great, everything's just ducky peachy NO GODDAMMIT THE BARON SUCKED!!!

Since you only had one comment on the score, let's start there lol

> I ranked the score album my second least favourite of the year after
> finally finishing it, which took about a week. I did find that I kinda
> liked a bunch of the music in context, though, so I dunno...I bet if I
> took my two or three fave cues from the sketchbook and mixed them with
> about half of the actual score album, I'd have a 3.5/5 or even higher
> listening experience.

Yeah that's fair. I don't rank the stuff I don't like because that requires further thought. Honestly I might not even bother moving Dune up in my rankings, it's still not good enough for me to worry about it being in my year end rankings. No consensus yet on if the sketchbook is worthwhile so I guess that's all there is to it for me. Though the main theme's still in my head, has been all day.

> I have a feeling I need to watch it again (the rare time no longer being a
> movie reviewer might be beneficial -- would've felt bad if I had written
> the 2.5/5 or 3/5 review I feel after one viewing, then watch it again and
> go 'ohhhh THAT'S what everyone else saw').

> I just felt so much apathy to the film apart from the nifty visuals (which
> I must also say -- I think I'm getting a bit bored with the 'Villenvenue
> Style'. Yes, every shot is very mannered and precise and epic-looking, but
> there's also very little passion or energy to them, and does EVERY shot
> have to be dark and backlit?). But the story stops right when it's about
> to get interesting, and the main characters are all so route and sterile I
> couldn't give less of a fuck about anyone.

> Plus, I couldn't stop seeing Edward Scissorhands with Paul.

> So I dunno...considering this was my most-looking-forward-to movie of the
> last couple years, I was very disappointed.

I mean, you knew it wasn't really going to be an action-packed space opera, right? I do feel like some of the political intrigue (plus the whole wrinkle where the Duke knows they're walking into a trap and that there's a traitor, he just doesn't know who got dropped) was underexplained, and maybe sacrificed to keep the story ticking. But still, I think you're underselling the acting. There's a ton of detail in Rebecca Ferguson's performance, Oscar Isaac is great as always (or maybe I'm just a sucker for "You're my son" dialogue), this is the first role where I really liked Jason Momoa in something. Chalamet was...fine, he works.

> Solid flick with a ton of
> artistry behind it but shit, does it reeeeeally need the other half of it.

It's now been confirmed!

> Lots of good points there. I would recommend Toto's original score,
> though, as well as the flick itself -- it's a mess, but a gloriously
> interesting mess, and frankly I find it more entertaining (and bizarre,
> and engaging) than the 2021 version. Worse movie, for sure, but somehow
> that's part of why it's more fun to watch.

> Plus, oh yeah, that's the other thing -- the Baron SUCKED in this
> version!!! In the original I was flat-out scared as a kid watching him
> float around a fat disgusting vampire sucking blood and laughing
> maniacally and being super rape-y. So freaky and icky. Skarsgaard here
> basically just growls in the darkness and occasionally floats in the
> background for a couple scenes, and that's it. Fuck, this movie pissed me
> off.

I do wonder if scaling back some of the rapeiness was an effort to avoid how in the book, the Baron is gay and it's tied in with his thing for young men/boys and his general villainy. Like, it's a difficult choice to make, either keep the thing to make him more despicable, or avoid having the only queer-coded person in the story be this horrific predator.

> ..............but I'm trying to be more positive with stuff cause I'm
> starting to think I'm actually irritating folks around here, some of whom
> I'd consider friends, so I best shut up now.

Has anyone said anything? I know I argue with you a lot but I also do the same with CK and I haven't told him to shut up lol.

> Everything's fine. Dune's
> fine. Movie's are great, music is great, everything's just ducky peachy

Honestly this is more irritating than being negative about things lol. You don't have to pretend everything's fine, I sure don't.

> NO
> GODDAMMIT THE BARON SUCKED!!!

There he is!

> Since you only had one comment on the score, let's start there lol

> Yeah that's fair. I don't rank the stuff I don't like because that
> requires further thought. Honestly I might not even bother moving Dune up
> in my rankings, it's still not good enough for me to worry about it being
> in my year end rankings. No consensus yet on if the sketchbook is
> worthwhile so I guess that's all there is to it for me. Though the main
> theme's still in my head, has been all day.

I’d love to know what the main theme is — felt like I knew when I saw the flick and I think I kinda sorta remember it from reading yours and Jon’s reviews buuuuut…damn, I dunno. I miss The Peacemaker. Totally unrelated, just….I miss it.

> I mean, you knew it wasn't really going to be an action-packed space
> opera, right? I do feel like some of the political intrigue (plus the
> whole wrinkle where the Duke knows they're walking into a trap and that
> there's a traitor, he just doesn't know who got dropped) was
> underexplained, and maybe sacrificed to keep the story ticking. But still,
> I think you're underselling the acting. There's a ton of detail in Rebecca
> Ferguson's performance, Oscar Isaac is great as always (or maybe I'm just
> a sucker for 'You're my son' dialogue), this is the first role where I
> really liked Jason Momoa in something. Chalamet was...fine, he works.

Yes, I was fully expecting it to be exactly as it was. But after reading the over-the-moon early reviews I just expected a little bit more depth and dare I say warmth than Blade Runner 2049, which is maybe the only movie I’ve given 3.5/5 to and have seen four times and fallen asleep at least once every single time.

Space politics and slow stuff is just fine by me - I frickin love Ingmar Bergman for Christ sakes and his movies rarely had a pulse above comatose. But when bud movies are done I feel like somethings changed, both in myself and for the characters.

But with Dune, I don’t know what the fuck I’m supposed to feel. Momoa was fine but then he died. Isaac was fine and then he died. Ferguson had some nice dramatic crying scenes but didn’t actually do anything in the movie. And speaking of doing nothing, our main character was more passive than Harry Potter after getting slipped some roofies in his polyjuice potion.

I just….yeah, I just am not sure what people are getting from this movie. I like cold, difficult science fiction like 2001 and Solaris, but those movies surprised me with their visuals and storytelling enough to justify the lack of relateabke characters. This just showed DARK EPIC SHOT after DARK EPIC SHOT and proceeded pretty much exactly as every other Dune thing has (not it’s fault, has to adapt a well traversed book, but still…)

> It's now been confirmed!

Thank the sweet mercy, but still…I won’t feel completely satisfied until it’s so far done it’s sitting in my living room haha.

> I do wonder if scaling back some of the rapeiness was an effort to avoid
> how in the book, the Baron is gay and it's tied in with his thing for
> young men/boys and his general villainy. Like, it's a difficult choice to
> make, either keep the thing to make him more despicable, or avoid having
> the only queer-coded person in the story be this horrific predator.

That’s a solid point I hadn’t considered. I liked that the villain was gay before because at least it added SOME sexuality to the flick…but you’re right, that could easily come across negatively now. I guess their only bet would’ve been to have him prey on boys and girls, but….yeah. Solid point.

> Has anyone said anything? I know I argue with you a lot but I also do the
> same with CK and I haven't told him to shut up lol.

Nah, haven’t been told much other than seeing a progression of posts from here and Facebook of boarders asking me to calm the fuck down and stop being so negative. Politely and often barely, true, but still something I’m picking up on.

Which is fair, for sure, it just…it’s weird, when the two biggest passions you’ve ever had your entire life both stop working like they always have. And it’s hard not to keep talking about that.

> Honestly this is more irritating than being negative about things lol. You
> don't have to pretend everything's fine, I sure don't.

> There he is!

😈

> - Bagpipes for House Atreides. Something else I like conceptually, but
> they only appear twice, and the second time is very sudden. My roommate
> burst out laughing when they showed up during the battle. I'd even played
> 'Armada' for him a few weeks ago so he subconsciously knew it was coming.
> Basically, it feels like a tacked on thing, not really integrated into the
> score as a whole. (There's an argument to be made this is by design, since
> the Atreides are sent to rule a planet they know nothing of and cannot
> adapt to. But then again, whatever other music there is for the Imperium
> and Harkonnen don't clash as sharply with the Fremen music, and in fact
> the bagpipes come in the midst of a battle with the former, so I don't
> think it should stick out as sharply.)

Agreed on this, especially the performance in Armada. Was jarring the theater, although I think a lot of the blame lies with the sound design that buries the cue's transition into the bagpipes under sound effect such that they feel like they blast out of nowhere.

> Other:
> - Should I listen to Toto's Dune score? Also should I listen to the other
> Zimmer albums? (Unless there's an overwhelming response of yes, I won't.)

Yes to Toto. Yes to the Sketchbook album, which has some more interesting versions of ideas found on the main album.

> - Dave Bautista doesn't have a big role in this film, but also for my
> money he's the best actor to come out of pro wrestling.

I'm neutral/negative on Bautista generally, but his character should have a much larger role in the (just-announced) sequel. Echoing Riley's sentiments, I was similarly underwhelmed by the Baron here. Removing his rape-y tendencies and having Stellan play it more subdued doesn't leave much to create a sense of menace, which is why Zimmer tries really hard to sell the Baron simply rising into the air as the most terrifying thing you've ever seen. Gotta do what you can, I guess.

> Rad-swaggity.

Arrival is 3/5 tops.

> Agreed on this, especially the performance in Armada. Was jarring the
> theater, although I think a lot of the blame lies with the sound design
> that buries the cue's transition into the bagpipes under sound effect such
> that they feel like they blast out of nowhere.

Thinking about it more, and I don't even think reprising the theme a bunch was necessary, just have that bagpipe texture present in some of the other Atreides based cues so it's still part of the world.

> Yes to Toto. Yes to the Sketchbook album, which has some more interesting
> versions of ideas found on the main album.

Okay, it's unanimous on Toto so far, one vote for sketchbook.

> I'm neutral/negative on Bautista generally, but his character should have
> a much larger role in the (just-announced) sequel.

For sure. And now that Part 2 is greenlit, they'll have to cast Feyd-Rautha too!

> Echoing Riley's
> sentiments, I was similarly underwhelmed by the Baron here. Removing his
> rape-y tendencies and having Stellan play it more subdued doesn't leave
> much to create a sense of menace, which is why Zimmer tries really hard to
> sell the Baron simply rising into the air as the most terrifying thing
> you've ever seen. Gotta do what you can, I guess.

Eh, worked for me, I totally forgot he has a floating machine thing.

> Arrival is 3/5 tops.

3/5 is still better than any Harold Faltermeyer score.

How dare you imply that Top Gun isn’t a 4/5!

> How dare you imply that Top Gun isn’t a 4/5!

If it was, that would make Beverly Hills Cop 5/5.

Anyway, I'm just saying that because I wanted to hurt Luke, to paraphrase Loki, "Slowly, intimately, in all the ways I know he fears."

> If it was, that would make Beverly Hills Cop 5/5.

> Anyway, I'm just saying that because I wanted to hurt Luke, to paraphrase
> Loki, 'Slowly, intimately, in all the ways I know he fears.'

You know me too well. At least you didn't come for either of my sons, Bill Conti or Dave Grusin.

Also Beverly Hills Cop 2 is 5/5.

> If it was, that would make Beverly Hills Cop 5/5.

What? The Top Gun Anthem is superior any day to Axel F!

> Anyway, I'm just saying that because I wanted to hurt Luke, to paraphrase
> Loki, 'Slowly, intimately, in all the ways I know he fears.'

Haha

Well, if the score sounded like Star Wars and Star Trek meets films like Lawrence of Arabia, Partition, Caravans, and other great scores that use Middle Eastern instrumentation and chord progressions (maybe a different composer would have worked on that one), would it be better in your opinion?

> Well, if the score sounded like Star Wars and Star Trek
> meets films like Lawrence of Arabia, Partition,
> Caravans, and other great scores that use Middle Eastern
> instrumentation and chord progressions (maybe a different composer would
> have worked on that one), would it be better in your opinion?

It's hard to compare it to a hypothetical score, and I try to not let what I hope/want a score to be get in the way of judging what the score actually is. So I don't know. Zimmer's score does use Middle Eastern instruments and "desert sounding" progressions, but I don't think the score *needed* to be orchestral to succeed.

All that said, I *did* write a review of a hypothetical masterpiece Dune score last winter, if you want a laugh: https://www.filmtracks.com/scoreboard/forum.cgi?read=89649

> So let's start with the film. Without getting too into the weeds for those
> that haven't seen it, I really enjoyed it. I'm impressed they managed to
> adapt (half of) Dune into a good movie, but as far as I can remember it's
> a pretty faithful adaptation of the film too. It's got its issues, and
> there was a scene or two I wish had been better fleshed out, but it was a
> good time overall, didn't feel its length, and stopped at a pretty good
> point in the story. Really hope we get part 2. Also, there are 4 worm
> appearances, so I'm tempted to give it 4/4.

It's a strong 4/5 for me. Really liked it but felt the third act started to drag near the end. Still, what a mesmerizing Sci-Fi epic this is.

> So, what did I like about the score?
> - The main theme. Unsure whether it's meant for Paul or more the
> planet/film as a whole, but the one with the desert-sounding rising
> arpeggio on the duduk. Good stuff, has some of the best variation and
> development, and it's very Zimmer-y. That last part is neither a good nor
> a bad thing, but it's always nice to hear those little composer
> signatures.

Yeah, it seems to be doing double duty as both the general Main theme as well as specifically for Paul. Also really dig it. Reminds me of the more flowing writing in Thin Red Line, which I love.

> - The percussion used to represent the Fremen. Unsure what kind of drum
> that is, but it sounds great. So crisp!

I thought that was more of an Arrakis motif? Ugh... Zimmer's muddled thematic applications are frustrating here.

> - 'Armada' is a pretty solid cue.

Also very effective in context.

> Other:
> - Some of Robert's comments in his original post are pretty strange to me,
> the album doesn't 'end with a whimper, barely summarizing his ideas at the
> finale.' Like, it's a pretty drawn out merging of the main theme with the
> wailing motif. Also, wailing motif is pretty clearly about Paul's power.

Yeah... not surprised Robert hates this, but that comment also struck me as odd. Even back in September I never thought it was ending "with a whimper".

> - Should I listen to Toto's Dune score? Also should I listen to the other
> Zimmer albums? (Unless there's an overwhelming response of yes, I won't.)

Re: Toto's Dune
YES! It's really good.

https://soundtrack-universe.blogspot.com/2019/08/dune-review.html

> - The wailing motif has most of the same notes as Harmonica's theme from
> Morricone's OUATITW and it cracks me up.

Aye, first thing I noticed about it.

> Anyway, Dune the film is great, Dune the score is fine. Whatever, I still
> can't work up that much of a passion about it in either direction haha.
> 2/5.

XD
OK man, at least you kinda like it now.

> It's a strong 4/5 for me. Really liked it but felt the third act started
> to drag near the end. Still, what a mesmerizing Sci-Fi epic this is.

I kinda respect Villeneuve was just like "Screw it, I'm not pretending to make this a complete story, pay me to make part 2 and you'll get your ending."

> Yeah, it seems to be doing double duty as both the general Main theme as
> well as specifically for Paul. Also really dig it. Reminds me of the more
> flowing writing in Thin Red Line, which I love.

Not where my brain went. The slower melody on top of the arpeggios reminded me of Man of Steel.

> I thought that was more of an Arrakis motif? Ugh... Zimmer's muddled
> thematic applications are frustrating here.

*Wailing in frustration*

> Re: Toto's Dune
> YES! It's really good.

Damn, there's a lot of love for this score

> XD
> OK man, at least you kinda like it now.

Sure.

Random contributions:

- I thought the movie was alright. It seems like all of my friends were blown away and I just felt like I spent three hours feeling “mildly intrigued”
- I must have a abnormally high tolerance for “out of nowhere” score moments, because the bagpipes in the battle scene was one of the few times the film actually got me a little pumped
- Agreed on the score volume. Some scenes very much were just an aural assault by Zimmer, but I expected that going in
- The floating bad guy was one of the times people in the theatre (including myself started laughing), so I think they bungled things a bit on the menacing villain front
- Really feel like a need Part Two, both of the score and the film, to know how my feelings on it end up

> Random contributions:

> - I thought the movie was alright. It seems like all of my friends were
> blown away and I just felt like I spent three hours feeling “mildly
> intrigued”
> - I must have a abnormally high tolerance for “out of nowhere” score
> moments, because the bagpipes in the battle scene was one of the few times
> the film actually got me a little pumped
> - Agreed on the score volume. Some scenes very much were just an aural
> assault by Zimmer, but I expected that going in
> - The floating bad guy was one of the times people in the theatre
> (including myself started laughing), so I think they bungled things a bit
> on the menacing villain front

Duke Leto be like: https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/they-fly-now/photos

> - Really feel like a need Part Two, both of the score and the film, to
> know how my feelings on it end up

Score I feel like things are pretty clear cut to me. Though of course the second one could change my opinion on this one.

I thought the film's storytelling was well done and had exceptional cinematography. I enjoyed it and look forward to the sequel.

As of Zimmer's score, the tsunami of sound of yesteryear returned and distracted when it hit. Its waves washed me out of the theater and hurt my ears. Louder does not mean better. The overall soundscape seems to align with Villeneueve's aural aesthetic, so Zimmer fulfilled his contract.

Final assessment; apathy (not hate), and no sense of wonderment. At the end of the day I do not envision any impetus to revisit this score in the future as it did not catalyze any lasting or deeply felt emotional response - the only reason I listen to music.

We move on.

All the best